JW dates research
- C.Aamold
- Nov 4, 2024
- 50 min read
Updated: Sep 1
607B.C.
NOTE: I do not subscribe to any religion. I once believed in Masoretic Text translations until I dug deeper and came to a different conclusion during my search through Christian denominational teachings, their leaders, and the roots of how they started, while reading the Bible itself verse by verse a few times (many translations) or more to match up their beliefs to the spiritual book they claim to follow and believe in themselves. If you ask me what I believe, I would say what the scholarly census has agreed upon, even if the decision board doesn't agree with them because they're worried about the faith of humanity for what they were taught to believe despite it contradicting evidence. Anything I've studied, watched, read is added here to help you see how I got to this point to help others who are curious too.
What they said
The inscriptions further show that news of his father’s death brought Nebuchadnezzar back to Babylon, and on the first of Elul (August-September), he ascended the throne. In this his accession year he returned to Hattu, and “in the month Shebat [January-February, 624 B.C.E.] he took the vast booty of Hattu to Babylon.” (Assyrian and Babylonian Chronicles, by A. K. Grayson, 1975, p. 100) In 624 B.C.E., in the first official year of his kingship, Nebuchadnezzar again led his forces through Hattu; he captured and sacked the Philistine city of Ashkelon. (See ASHKELON.) During his second, third, and fourth years as king he conducted additional campaigns in Hattu, and evidently in the fourth year he made Judean King Jehoiakim his vassal. (2Ki 24:1) Also, in the fourth year Nebuchadnezzar led his forces to Egypt, and in the ensuing conflict both sides sustained heavy losses.
When you read about Jeremiah and Ebed-melech, are you confident that they were real people? Recently, the account in Jeremiah chapter 38 that mentions them gained added support from two discoveries made in the ancient City of David.
Archaeologist Eilat Mazar reports unearthing a small clay seal impression, or bulla. It was found in 2005 during a supervised excavation of a layer dating back to when Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 B.C.E. The seal bears the ancient Hebrew name “Yehuchal ben Shelemyahu,” which is “Jucal the son of Shelemiah” in English.
Later, in a similar layer and just a few yards away, another bulla was uncovered. It bears the name “Gedalyahu ben Pashhur,” or “Gedaliah the son of Pashhur.”
Now read at Jeremiah 38:1 the names of two princes who urged King Zedekiah to have Jeremiah put to death, a plan that Ebed-melech thwarted. Yes, those named in Jeremiah chapter 38 were real people.
What was really said
13 he marched about victoriously 12 in Hattu. 13 In the month Shebat he took the vast booty of Hattu to Babylon.
[2] A. K. Grayson, Assyrian and Babylonian Chronicles. Eisenbrauns, 2000, [Online]. Available: https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=ydcGZA6k5nwC.
What the Assyrian and Babylonian chronicles said. No date, they added.
Their article on this even has the footnotes that no bible scholar believes this, and their conclusion is 587.
2Kings 25:8 "the 19th year of King Neb" when did he reign? 605.. count down 19. = around 586-587...
They NEED 607 for 1914 and 1919, this also links to "in the lord's day" in revelations in Rev 1, because that day they say is 1914. when they actually changed scripture from "on" to "in", from meditating on sabbath to someday in the future.
How do you explain that 607 BCE is a scriptural prophecy for the destruction of Jerusalem, when Darius fourth year was 518 BCE and they had already been through the 70-year exile, making the destruction 588 BCE, as recorded in Zechariah 7:1-5?
1881
By 1881, Russell had found a biblical basis for extending the harvest to a new date, later that year.[5] He explained:
Coming to the spring of 1878 [...] we naturally and not unreasonably expected some change of our condition, and all were more or less disappointed when nothing supernatural occurred. But our disappointment was brief, for we noticed that the Jewish church (and not the Gospel church) was the pattern of ours, and therefore we should not expect parallels to Pentecost or to anything which happened in the beginning of this church.[12]
Russell wrote that "the light upon our pathway still shines and is more and more glorious" and that since 1878 the light had glowed stronger. The timing of their translation to heaven seemed nearer, he wrote: "We know not the day or hour, but expect it during 1881, possibly near the autumn where the parallels show the favor to Zion complete and due to end, the door to the marriage to shut, and the high calling to be the bride of Christ, to cease."[12]
The second failure in 1881 precipitated a more serious crisis in the Bible Student ranks and for several years Russell's followers waited for the belated translation to occur.[5] Russell's chronological timetable had already identified 1914 as the ultimate end of the "time of trouble", and this preserved the commitment of followers who might have been discouraged by their failed expectations for 1881.[13] Yet many members found it inconceivable that their earthly departure might be delayed that long.[14]
Russell consoled members with the news that 1881 had still marked the time when "death became a blessing" in the sense that any saint who died would henceforth be instantaneously changed into a spirit being.[14] The revised view provided comfort for early believers who had held the view that the living faithful would never experience a physical death, and yet had seen other members in fact dying while they awaited their upward call. After 1881, physical death was defined as one of the ways in which some of the saints might undergo their translation.[5]
He thought of them being the Jewish church. And only them, no one else. Why even think that? Why mark this as them, when this was back in Christian killing times? His theory has a huge gap of time, these times started after the last apostle died if anything, not almost 2k years later, this whole time since their persecution has been counted. This is like the Zionist is it not?
Year doesn't matter either, did Jesus have to literally draw a picture for people to know he meant years too?
It's been a blessing forever, to not be born or to be still born was a blessing in OT times so we don’t have to face temptation, this verse was to help people from the early church times to face their death like Jesus did, and to encourage us today since then, not just at a specific time later.
Gaslight, gaslight, gaslight..
1874
The Scriptural proof is that the second presence of the Lord Jesus Christ began in 1874 A.D.
"Something else that was seen as a possible time indicator involved the arrangement that God instituted in ancient Israel for a Jubilee, a year of release, every 50th year. This came after a series of seven 7-year periods, each of which ended with a sabbath year. During the Jubilee year, Hebrew slaves were freed and hereditary land possessions that had been sold were restored. (Lev. 25:8-10) Calculations based on this cycle of years led to the conclusion that perhaps a greater Jubilee for all the earth had begun in the autumn of 1874, that evidently the Lord had returned in that year and was invisibly present, and that “the times of restitution of all things” had arrived.—Acts 3:19-21, KJ."
Millers date.
So, since he didn't show up then…. like he didn't show up in 1914…they used the same reasoning for why he didn't show up in 1914.
1914
Be not surprised, then, when in subsequent chapters we present proofs that the setting up of the Kingdom of God is already begun, that it is pointed out in prophecy as due to begin the exercise of power in A. D. 1878, and that the < < battle of the great day of God Almighty ' ' (Rev. 16:14.), which will end in A. D. 191 4 with the complete overthrow of earth's present rulership, is already commenced. The gathering of the armies is plainly visible from the standpoint of God's Word.
Be not surprised, then, when in subsequent chapters we present proofs that the setting up of the Kingdom of God is already begun, that it is pointed out in prophecy as due to begin the exercise of power in A.D. 1878, and that the “battle of the great day of God Almighty” (Rev. 16:14), which will end in A.D. 1915, with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced. The gathering of the armies is plainly visible from the standpoint of God’s Word.
Older and newer versions, they changed the date.
In the years following 1919, God’s people were blessed with more and more flashes of spiritual light. (Read Psalm 97:11.) In 1925, a landmark article appeared in The Watch Tower, entitled “Birth of the Nation.” It laid out convincing Scriptural evidence that the Messianic Kingdom had been born in 1914, fulfilling the prophetic picture of God’s heavenly woman giving birth, as recorded in Revelation chapter 12.b The article further showed that the persecution and trouble that came upon Jehovah’s people during those war years were clear signs that Satan had been hurled down from heaven, “having great anger, knowing that he has a short period of time.”—Rev. 12:12."
What about all the other people that got persecuted before them in the crusades? what makes their rough time so "special", are we just ignoring that the people Paul were talking to in his letters weren't going through persecution daily and being fed to lions for their belief?
Kingdom made in bible times for sure after his ascension since they were being "transferred to it".
Jesus warned there would be wars and rumors of wars and that was NOT the end.
At first, they thought that by that date the Kingdom of God would have obtained full, universal control. When that did not occur, their confidence in the Bible prophecies that marked the date did not waver. They concluded that, instead, the date had marked only a starting point as to Kingdom rule.
Similarly, they also first thought that global troubles culminating in anarchy (which they understood would be associated with the war of “the great day of God the Almighty”) would precede that date. (Rev. 16:14) But then, ten years before 1914, the Watch Tower suggested that worldwide turmoil that would result in the annihilating of human institutions would come right after the end of the Gentile Times. They expected the year 1914 to mark a significant turning point for Jerusalem, since the prophecy had said that ‘Jerusalem would be trodden down’ until the Gentile Times were fulfilled. When they saw 1914 drawing close and yet they had not died as humans and been ‘caught up in the clouds’ to meet the Lord—in harmony with earlier expectations—they earnestly hoped that their change might take place at the end of the Gentile Times.—1 Thess. 4:17.
They thought it would be theocracy.
Theocracy is a form of government in which one or more deities are recognized as supreme ruling authorities, giving divine guidance to human intermediaries who manage the government's daily affairs. From <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theocracy>.
They admit it isn't, and wasn't, but today all they say is Theocracy and that’s what they are, GB also calls themselves now, "the kings". But they can't be, because they do not rule the world and they are having to obey secular government laws and regulations and are trying as hard as they can to not do so.
They also came to understand that it was in the year 1914 that Christ’s invisible presence had begun and that this was, not by his personally returning (even invisibly) to the vicinity of the earth, but by his directing his attention toward the earth as ruling King. They saw and accepted the vital responsibility that was theirs to proclaim “this good news of the kingdom” for a witness to all nations during this critical time of human history.
The apostles were doing this and having disciples do this as well. So why would they think this is now the time to do this and not before 1914? Not to mention that it's been "Christendom" no matter what denomination to give the good news of salvation. They are the only ones that have a different salvation message of it coming to Jesus, where there's is, come to the men's organization.
There is only one Parousia event, and every eye will see him, and he will stand on mount olives.
For example, they expected that the full number of anointed Christians would be raised to heaven by October 1914. They also thought that the war that started in 1914 would lead directly on to the end of Satan’s world.
So, when more deaths came at WW2 what were they saying then?
Original teachings
Summary
-The last days began 1799
-Jesus Parousia started 1874
-Jesus started ruling in heaven 1878
-The gentile times would end in 1914 resulting in the
-End of Armageddon
-Fall of false religion (how they say they are the one church that wasn't false and were then in 1919 being used after this flush out)
-End of all earthly gov
-Heavenly and earthly rezzes
-Paradise on earth
-The changing last days
-The 1914 doctrine chases as it is falsified by the progression of history
-The last days started in 1799, ending in 1914
-The last days starting in 1914, ending within a single lifetime/generation of those born prior to 1914
-The last days started in 1914, with an unspecified ending, after a period of an "overlapping generation"
"Our belief that the Kingdom began to be setup, or brought into power, in April, 1878, be it observed, rests on exactly the same foundation as our belief that the Lord became present in October, 1874, and that the harvest began at that time."
"… from the beginning of the Lord’s presence in 1874 the Devil used the Papal system as the chief opposing instrument of God’s kingdom …"
"Based on the premise that events of the first century might find parallels in related events later, they also concluded that if Jesus’ baptism and anointing in the autumn of 29 C.E. paralleled the beginning of an invisible presence in 1874, then his riding into Jerusalem as King in the spring of 33 C.E. would point to the spring of 1878 as the time when he would assume his power as heavenly King."
In that very same year:
"The Watchtower[1] has consistently presented evidence to honest hearted students of Bible prophecy that Jesus’ presence in heavenly Kingdom power began in 1914. Events since that year testify to Jesus' invisible presence."
"Jehovah's Witnesses have consistently shown from the Scriptures that the year 1914 marked the beginning of this world's time of the end and that "the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men" has drawn near."
Pyramidology
In the passages of the Great Pyramid of Gizeh the
agreement of one or two measurements with the present-
truth chronology might be accidental, but the corres-
pondency of dozens of measurements proves that the
same God designed both pyramid and plan— and at the
same time proves the correctness of the chronology.
The agreement of the chronology with certain meas-
urements of the Tabernacle and the Temple of Ezekiel
further stamps the chronology as true.
It is on the basis of such and so many corresponden-
cies— in accordance with the soundest laws known to
science— that we affirm that, Scripturally, scientifically,
and historically, present-truth chronology is correct be
yond a doubt. Its reliability has been abundantly con
firmed by the dates and events of 1874, 1914, and 1918.
Present-truth chronology is a secure basis on which the
consecrated child of God may endeavor to search out
things to come.— 1 Peter 1: 1 1 ,1 2 ; John 16- 13.
It is not necessary to show how if a change of 19 'ears
were made in the chronology the time from Jacob to
Jesus would become shortened from 1845 to 1826 years,
and the entire system of dates based on the “ Jewish
parallels” would collapse; how the jubilee system dates
would fall out of place from its present symmetry; how
the 2520-year parallels would disappear; how the entire
system of dates would be scattered; how there could be
no foundation for faith in the resulting chronological
jumble; and how there could be no sound reason for
believing in the presence of the Lord, the place and
work of Pastor Bussell, the end of the age, the harvest
work, or in any of the literature published by the So-
ciety. Many years ago all these matters were deeply
considered by Pastor Bussell, and he declared, in an
article which we will soon republish, that a change of
one year would destroy the entire system of chronology.
PRESENT-TRUTH CHRONOLOGY IS CORRECT
We have found that the present-truth chronology is
correct and others are incorrect because:
(1 ) It is based squarely on inspired prophecy.
( 2 ) The fulfillment is recorded in the Bible and in
the history of God’ s chosen people, the Jews.
(3 ) The seventy years are all years of desolation.
(4 ) There was no captivity and no vassalage of Judah
in 625 B. C. from which to count the seventy years
captivity o t servitude.
(5) Pagan “ history” on the subject is unreliable.
(C) The opinions of “ authorities” on this pagan
“ history” are guesses and conjectures.
(7 ) The monumental inscriptions are untrustworthy
because of the untruthfulness and unreliability of the
demon-worshiping and demon-controlled pagan mon-
archs.
( 8 ) The inscriptions omit some important facts and
falsify others.
(9 ) The archaeologists are not conscientious or honest
in presenting the inscriptions.
(10) Reliance upon pagan history or archaeology leads
through worse doubts and ever more of them, into in
fidelity.
( 1 1 ) Present-truth chronology is correct beyond the
possibility of a doubt.
Present-truth chronology is based upon divine proph-
ecy and its Biblical fulfillment, that the seventy years
were years of desolation, not part desolation and part
captivity. The chronology stands firm as a rock, based
upon the Word of God.
It is a matter of faith in Jehovah and in his inspired
Word. (2 Timothy 3 :1 6 ) Those that lack faith in God’ s
Word and cast about for needless help from admittedly
lying pagan records, will doubtless receive according
to their lack of faith. Those that stick closely to that
Word will receive according to their faith.
So what dates were what then?
Demonizing archeologist, yet CR went and measured these temples multiple times.
Before this, saying they shouldn't try and lay out the time frame in judges.
They reject evidenced, those archeologists were people that went to prove the bible correct.
What they tell their own people about their founders work to find such dates they rely on:
November 15 1928
42 Of course no one can tell exactly how Satan reasoned, but the facts show that the above process of reasoning is exactly in line with what has come to pass. Those who have devoted themselves to the pyramid have failed to see some of the most important things that God has revealed for the benefit of his church. The mind of such was turned away from Jehovah and his Word.
43 In another place the prophet says: “Woe to them that go down to Egypt for help.” (Isa. 31:1) Whether we give this text a literal or a symbolic meaning, it is a warning to Israel after the spirit, that is to say, the new creation. If we apply it literally, it means that the new creatures have gone down to literal Egypt to find proof to corroborate God’s plan, which is wrong. If we apply it symbolically, it means that new creatures have gone down to the world for help. They have such corroborative proof of worldy wisdom expressed in stone. This wisdom proceeds not from God but from the Devil. The correct interpretation of this text undoubtedly is that the Christian should not seek wisdom from the world or from anything that is in the world, but should always look unto Jehovah, who speaks to his children through his Word. The Devil’s purpose at all times is to turn the mind of man away from God’s Word.
Shift blaming (something they regularly do when they get something wrong)-aka narc spirit)
Basically, calling CR, their own founder an idiot and the devil.
These measurements were based off astronomy as well by a "Professor Smyth".
Some wiki
The belief was unequivocal, based on his study of the Bible and the Great Pyramid, and satisfied only upon the establishment of an earthly paradise. Russell remarked that altering the prophecy by even one year would destroy the perfect symmetry of its biblical chronology.[16] In the second book of his Studies in the Scriptures series he described it as "an established truth that the final end of the kingdoms of this world, and the full establishment of the Kingdom of God, will be accomplished at the end of A.D. 1914".[17] The result, he wrote, was that "all present governments will be overthrown and dissolved",[17] along with the destruction of "what God calls Babylon, and what men call Christendom".[18] In an 1894 Watch Tower, responding to readers who questioned whether—because of recent political upheavals—the world could last until 1914, he wrote:
We see no reason for changing the figures—nor could we change them if we would, They are, we believe, God's dates, not ours. But bear in mind that the end of 1914 is not the date for the beginning, but for the end of the time of the trouble.[19]
Not even one year and it would crumble, why they can't believe 587b.c. or 597b.c and discredit scholars/archology.
Gods dates, even though we are told we or Jesus could know. "ours" is, all these dates they've made. They are saying God gave them this… they are saying God is a liar or confused, or unclear.
Still trouble…
When again nothing took place, predictions regressed to their earlier short-term orientation. The Watch Tower wrote: "It may be that many of the Lord's people were expecting more than they should have looked for to occur with the opening of the Jewish year 1915, which began with September 21. The human mind seems to have a natural tendency, and one with which we should have sympathy, to expect matters to culminate more rapidly, fulfillments to come more suddenly, than they ever do come [...] Studying God's Word, we have measured the 2520 years, the Seven symbolic Times, from that year 606 B.C. and have found that it reached down to October, 1914, as nearly as we were able to reckon. We did not say positively that this would be the year. We merely left everyone to look at the facts of history and reckon for himself."[23]
He took that opportunity to remind readers of some cautionary pronouncements he had made several years earlier. In 1912 he had left open the possibility that, if nothing happened in October 1914, it could still happen in October 1915. He also pointed out that the period of transition could run "a good many years".[16]
Shift blame again after a huge work up of fear mongering.
Measured from the pyramid.
"reckon" yeah ok…weren't they told to trust "Gods mouthpiece and faithful discreet servant?"
Facts of history? They said they were the church that God was working with and getting info from.
Yet "altering the prophecy by even one year would destroy the perfect symmetry of its biblical chronology".
I feel like they write so much in their watch towers that back then it was almost impossible to find what was said before unless you study them all like a bible which takes yeaaaars.
In a lengthy article of consolation, Russell wrote that it was a testing time for Christ's disciples and that some Bible Students had unreal expectations. He said it was also possible that God's Kingdom on earth would be established gradually:[13][16]
We find that some have one idea and others another. Some think that just the next hour after midnight would see a great, grand change everywhere—evil blotted out in sixty minutes or in sixty seconds. But would it be a reasonable expectation that the Gentile kingdoms would be snuffed out inside of an hour or inside of a day? If God had said so, it would be different; we know that God has all power to do His will everywhere. But are we in any sense of the word to expect such a sudden transition—that going to bed on the night of September 20, we would find, on the morning of September 21, all the kingdoms of the world destroyed and the Kingdom of Christ set up, the saints in glory, etc. Such would be a lightning change! We do not think that any would have been justified in so thinking. If any had such expectation, it was unwarranted.[23]
Yet on October 2, 1914, he entered the staff dining room at the Watch Tower Society headquarters and declared that the Gentile times had ended and that "their kings have had their day."[1] It signaled that God had withdrawn his benevolent disposition towards the Christian nations.[23] The statement implied that the legitimacy of earthly governments had been downgraded in the eyes of God, which sociologist Joseph Zygmunt suggested may have contributed to the subsequent adoption of bolder tactics in condemning the global political system.[5]
Russell viewed the outbreak of World War I as the beginning of Armageddon, which would soon descend into worldwide revolution[24] and in 1916, shortly before his death, he reaffirmed his conviction that the end was close and the harvest of saints was ongoing:
Some of us were quite strongly convinced that the Harvest would be ended by now, but our expectations must not be allowed to weigh anything as against the facts [...] We see no reason for doubting, therefore, that the Times of the Gentiles ended in October 1914; and that a few more years will witness their utter collapse and the full establishment of God's Kingdom in the hands of Messiah.[25]
Un real? Why work people up and show people what it would be like to not expect such things?
Gradually? It will happen when Christ returns, what will be the point of continuing to teach and build up when he does return?
He's a double speaker
They're saying the "rapture" is ongoing, because he was saying the "death is a blessing" from here on out, because they will enter... I mean, a special few will enter heaven only.
If gentile times were over, 1914, 1925, 1975… why are people still even becoming Christians, let alone partaking of the bread and wine if it's over? Multiple times?
It's like they are sort of trying to revert back to what the bible originally says that gentile times is awhile, and explaining how it worked throughout the history after the early church passed away, but just continuing the date further and further and then shift blaming when they get it wrong and reverting back to what it actually says, so confusing.
In posthumous editions of his Studies in the Scriptures, entire sections were rewritten to accommodate the failure of the anticipated events, with 1914 now identified as "the beginning of the end of Gentile times". The outbreak of World War I was taken to be its confirmation. Sociologist James Beckford claimed that Russell's "sometimes ingenious" ex post facto rationalizations of events in 1914 contributed to the survival of the Bible Student movement.[13] Under doctrinal changes introduced by his successor, Joseph Franklin Rutherford, it was later decided that the Millennium would come within the generation of those who saw the events of 1914. The years of 1799 and 1874, until then significant dates in Russell's millennial chronology, were also abandoned.[16]
Just say your WRONG.
Beginning of the end? Come on… the beginning of all this was after Paul and the apostles were done preaching then their letters started to correct the churches.
Why keep this up? Why keep these people in limbo? For power…
Pariousia
8 At that time the “presence” or parousia of the Lord Jesus Christ began. Hence, what is described in the parable of the sheep and the goats happens during his parousia. This includes the gathering of all the nations before him as the King who is present on his throne.
More 1914, and "invisible" Parousia is not him coming invisibly. But coming.
This is a 1-time event, not multiple.
If Jesus returned in 1914, why does he need an FDS, if he were to be given the finished reward at his return. And if the doctrine changed and it's not till, he gets back…. why how did he come in 1914?
(More 1914 is located in their roots page)
1918
PASTOR RUSSELL DEAD, BUT SPEAKING AGAIN
24:25, 26, Also, thou son of man, shall It not be In the day when I take from them their strength, the Joy of their glory, the desire of their eyes, and that whereupon they set their minds, their sons and their daughters. That he that escapeth In that day shall come unto thee, to cause thee to hear It with thine eara? — Also, In the year 1918, when God destroys the churches wholesale and the church members by millions. It shall be that any that escape shall come to the works of Pastor Russell to learn the meaning of the downfall of "Christianity."
27 Seventh, the congregation of Christ after the return of her Lord must, as the “house of God,” receive her judgment when Jehovah’s messenger comes to the temple for judgment, and this prior to the rest of the world. Only the remnant of Jehovah’s anointed witnesses experienced this judgment cleansing when the “messenger” came to his temple in 1918.—1 Pet. 4:17; Mal. 3:1-3.
Russell's final revision of his predictions was to identify 1918 as the new terminus.[5][26] The shift was based on the reasoning that the period of the Jews' favor may have lasted until 73 CE (the date of the Zealots' mass suicide at Masada), rather than 70 CE. For the modern-day parallel, the adjustment meant the conclusion of the 40-year "harvest period" was moved from 1914 to the northern spring of 1918.[1][27][28]
Rutherford claimed in 1917 that the testimony of Bible Students themselves confirmed that the harvest was not over: "Many have consecrated and given evidence of spirit-begetting since 1914, which is the best evidence that the harvest is not yet closed."[28] If the new date was reliable, he wrote, "and the evidence is very conclusive that it is true, then we have only a few months in which to labor before the great night settles down when no man can work."[28]
Just moved?
Mind you…. the rebellious Jews "great rebellion".
They saw themselves as the Jewish Zionist per CR, therefore, they are the rebellious Jews if they want to shove in these jews.
Ok…"is true" and they wonder why people are coming to "unreasonable expectations?
They were also selling Gods word and their own writings as well in these times.
At that time there is every reason to believe the fallen angels will invade the minds of many of the Nominal Church people, driving them to exceedingly unwise conduct and leading to their destruction at the hands of the enraged masses, who will later be dragged to the same fate [...] In one short year, 1917–1918, the vast and complicated system of sectarianism reaches its zenith of power, only to be suddenly dashed into oblivion [...] One large part of the adherents of ecclesiasticism will die from pestilence and famine.[29]
Projecting much?
But if they think they are the special ones that won't face this, of course they can't see that this is them as well, at least as the rank and file.
Sounds like they've made that pretty solid and clear that it IS happening…. they said it. they sealed it.
When 1918 also passed without any sign of fulfillment, the initial reaction was that the harvest had indeed finished and that the full complement of those destined for translation to heaven had been assembled. The further delay in the arrival of the millennium was interpreted in 1919 as a sign that the loyalty and powers of endurance of the "Kingdom class" were being tested, and that God was finding fault with some supposedly sanctified people.[27]
No one wondered why the "faithful servant" was still on the earth himself?
1919 was when he said they are the chosen church… but what about the "great crowd" within? They were going through judgement though the last battle has yet to happen?
In a 1922 convention address, Rutherford retrospectively defined 1918 as the time when Christ "entered the temple for the purpose of judgment".[30] He later wrote that it was only after 1918, when the Lord came to the temple, that it could be understood that 1914 had also marked the time when the heavenly part of God's kingdom was established and when a "New Nation" was born.[31]
Excuse me? Judgement day has already begun? Infront of the throne? Hello…?helllllo?
And this is when they officially changed what 1914 meant, scratching out anything that made it what it was that started this theory in the first place. Like… slide of hand, gaslighting. Like the people still alive that knew the other dates, just didn't see that, and this is what they actually meant… and they are at fault for thinking anything else, and those that left were not of God anyhow. No accountability whatsoever and double speak, and gaslighting.
From that time the Bible Student group was able to view itself as more than just an agency for completing the ranks of the 144,000 who would rule with Christ. With the "New Nation" already born, members were given a clear twofold purpose: (1) to recruit and train a "Great Company" who would be carried through Armageddon to live in the earthly kingdom and (2) to expose the machinations of the devil in trying to obstruct the kingdom's earthly establishment.[5]
So….144k was finished with? Yet JR still sat with them on a daily basis?
"the great crowd".
Rev 7 says "those that came out of the great tribulation" and they say the 144k are only a few remnant left on earth, so those other ones gone, will have to be brought back.
And anyone in there, that’s being built up, is what… also being taught by people being taught? How's that logical? Everyone's at the same starting point?
It is the holy spirit that does this work, not man's organization.
1925
Book
Beth Sarim
The Truth About the San Diego House
By B. J. Martin In view of the fact that there are so many slanderous reports circulated about Brother Rutherford, the real purpose of which is to injure the Lord's work, I feel disposed to give the facts concerning some of them, not for the benefit of the slanderers, but for the benefit of those who are really loyal to the Lord. SOCIETY'S BUILDINGS: During the past ten years the Society, under the business management of Brother Rutherford, has financed on a business basis and erected for the benefit of th«> work the following buildings: The Bethel Home, furnishing commodious quarters for the workers there. The Brooklyn factory, with a capacity of 20,000 volumes a day, in one of the best appointed and lighted factories in the world. A factory and home for the work in Switzerland.
A factory and home for the work and workers in Magdeburg, Germany. A home for the workers in Czechoslovakia. Prior to this period the Society rented its headquarters in most of the places, including London. In the last few years the Society has acquired title to the London Bethel. The Society has also built offices and a printing plant at Toronto, Canada. To my personal knowledge Brother Rutherford has been untiring in his efforts to get all this housing and equipment for the benefit of the Lord's work.
As is well known by the brethren, he and others were confined in prison during the War because of faithfulness to the Lord's cause. Following his release he had a severe ease of pneumonia, and since then has had only one good lung. It is almost impossible for him to remain in Brooklyn in the winter season and get on with the arduous duties that he has to perform. To my personal knowledge there is no man in America that does more real hard work daily than he. Four years ago he went to San Diego, California, under the treatment of Doctor Eckols. The climate is so superior to
that of almost any other place that Doctor Eckols has repeatedly urged him to spend as much time as possible in San Diego. When he goes he takes with him his office f otco and works early and late, and except for the work he has done the factories would not be able to operate and it is hardly probable that we could have been operating the radio stations.
It is not always convenient to get a comfortable place to live when it is necessary to rent a house for a few months. For the past two years I and other brethren close to Brother Rutherford have urged upon him the necessity of a house in San Diego where he can live and do the work that is so necessary to be done. Last year, in company with a few other brethren, we pressed this matter upon him, at that time the Lord having provided the means for the building of the house so that it would not be a burden on the Society. He finally consented that the house might be built only upon condition that it should be exclusively for the use of the Lord's work, henceforth and forever, and not for any private gain for anyone. In October, 1929, 1 went to California and acquired the title to the ground in my name and entered into a contract with the builder, and the house was constructed in my name. I again went to California at the beginning of the year 1930 to close up the building arrangements. I am happy to have any part in this because I know what it means for the Lord's work.
I feel sure that the Lord loves Brother Rutherford as much as he loved David. David built a house for himself and afterwards thought about building one for the Lord. After repeated urging by loyal brethren the San Diego house was built, but Brother Rutherford refused to have it for himself except to use it for the Lord's work. A deed was made conveying the title to the house. This deed was written by Brother Rutherford himself. I am certain there is no other deed to any piece of property like it under the sun. I am grateful to the Lord that I had anything to do with it. The deed is a matter of public record on the deed records of San Diego, California, and therefore I am at full liberty to publish it, and I do here submit the deed for publication so that all may see and understand how much Brother Rutherford has been libeled and slandered by those who would injure the Lord's work.
JR thought it was a visible rez of the 10 patriarchs, enough to go ahead and build a house for them in CA. He used it as his Winter home.
Proven Fact From God
Sign proclaiming "This means what it says - It is a fact"
"... this chronology is not of man, but of God.... the addition of more proofs removes it entirely from the realm of chance into that of proven certainty.... the chronology of present truth [is]... not of human origin." Watch Tower 1922 Jul 15 p.217
"The date 1925 is even more distinctly indicated by the Scriptures because it is fixed by the law God gave to Israel. Viewing the present situation in Europe, one wonders how it will be possible to hold back the explosion much longer; and that even before 1925 the great crisis will be reached and probably passed." Watch Tower 1922 Sep 1 p.262
"Our thought is, that 1925 is definitely settled by the Scriptures, marking the end of the typical jubilees. ... As to Noah, the Christian now has much more upon which to base his faith then Noah had (so far as the Scriptures reveal) upon which to base his faith in a coming deluge." Watch Tower 1923 Apr 1 p.106
"The year 1925 is a date definitely and clearly marked in Scriptures, even more clearly than that of 1914;…" Watchtower 1924 Jul 15 p.211
Fail speech
"We cannot be blamed for presenting from the Scriptures such evidence as they afford which leads us to believe that a certain event will take place at a given time. Sometimes the Lord has let His people looking for the right thing at the wrong time, and more frequently they have looked for the wrong things at the right time. But all the enemies of the cause of present truth in the earth are fervently hoping that the Bible students will not be so successful in 1925 in looking for the right thing at the right time as they were in 1914. If they are, however, it will be the other fellow that will have to do the explaining, and not we." Golden Age 1924 Feb 13 p.314
Worldly people would survive Armageddon?
"[Bible Students] Understood that people then living-mankind in general-had the opportunity to survive right into the time of restitution and that they would then be educated in Jehovah's requirements for life. If obedient, they would gradually attain to human perfection. If rebellious, they would, in time, be destroyed forever." Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom p.163
This goes against 2024 NEW Light, so they flip flopped.
Walking it back
"The "Millions Now Living Will Never Die" slogan applied only to the "great crowd" of "other sheep," mentioned in the Scriptures at Revelation 7:9 and John 10:16, whose destiny is an earthly paradise." Watchtower 1963 May 15 p.294
"In the early 1920's, a featured public talk presented by Jehovah's Witnesses was entitled "Millions Now Living Will Never Die." This may have reflected overoptimism at that time. But today that statement can be made with full confidence." Watchtower 1997 Jan 1 p.11
"This must be the class of persons that are often described as 'the millions now living that will never die'." Today, it is thrilling actually to see millions of these being marked for preservation, as they put on the true Christian personality, in a dedicated relationship to Jehovah through Christ Jesus. ...
Presented at that time was conclusive proof identifying the "great crowd" of Revelation 7:9 with the Lord's "other sheep" of John 10:16, with the Jehonadab class, with those marked in the forehead for survival, with the millions now living who will never die, and with "the sheep"... " Watchtower 1985 Mar 1 p.14
Shifting Blame as usual, no apology
"It was stated in the "Millions" book that we might reasonably expect them to return shortly after 1925, but this was merely an expressed opinion; besides it is still shortly after 1925." France — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
"Some anticipated that the work would end in 1925, but the Lord did not so state." Watch Tower 1926 Aug 1 p.232
"Instead of its being considered a 'probability,' they read into it that it was a 'certainty'." Part 2—United States of America — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
"Ever since the 1870's, Bible Students had been serving with a date in mind - first 1914, then 1925. Now they realized that they must serve for as long as Jehovah wishes." Daniel’s Prophetic Days and Our Faith — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
"On the basis of what was said there, many hoped that perhaps the remaining ones of the little flock would receive their heavenly reward by 1925. … Though mistaken, they eagerly shared it with others."Testing and Sifting From Within — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
"Although these tests resulted in a sifting and some blew away like chaff when wheat is winnowed, others remained firm." Testing and Sifting From Within — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
Said the same thing when JR took over and people didn't like it.
“Regarding his misguided statements as to what we could expect in 1925, he once confessed to us at Bethel, “I made an ass of myself.”” ‘Jehovah Has Dealt Rewardingly With Me’ — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
Changed History
"The anointed followers of Christ have been extending the invitation since as far back as 1918. In that year, the public talk entitled ‚ÄúMillions Now Living May Never Die‚Äù offered hope that many will gain life in a paradise earth after the battle of Armageddon." “The Spirit and the Bride Keep On Saying: ‘Come!’” — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
With Rutherford now the movement's chief theologian, another round of prophetic revision ensued, this time focusing on 1925.[5] In his 1920 booklet Millions Now Living Will Never Die, Rutherford wrote that he expected the ancient patriarchs and prophets, "the faithful ones of old", to be resurrected to earthly life in 1925 as a prelude to a general physical resurrection of faithful followers of God destined for everlasting life on earth. He explained:
This is the Golden Age of which the prophets prophesied and of which the Psalmist sang; and it is the privilege of the student of the divine Word today, by the eye of faith, to see that we are standing at the very portals of that blessed time! Let us look up and lift up our heads. Deliverance is at the door![32]
Rutherford's belief that the patriarchs' return would occur in 1925 was based on his calculations of the Jewish jubilee, counting forward 3500 years from 1575 BCE.[1][33] As the year advanced, he wrote of the urgency of witnessing in the "few remaining months",[34] though he also provided a caution that not all the expected events might occur.[35] When that prediction failed, the Watch Tower Society suspended the issuing of prophecies centered on a specific date.
Chryssides concluded: "This expectation was too specific and empirical for the date to be adjusted or the expected event spiritualised. At a convention the following year, Rutherford admitted his error, claiming that the 1925 date was 'merely an expressed opinion'."[1] Yet Rutherford did not abandon the prediction. In 1929 the Watch Tower Society bought a piece of land in San Diego, California, where a Spanish mansion was built and named Beth Sarim ("house of the Princes").[36]
As late as 1932 Rutherford was still delivering talks about the nearness of the kingdom: he declared that the preaching work of the Witnesses was "coming to a conclusion", that Armageddon was "only a short time away" and that the end was "much less than the length of a generation".[37] In the late 1930s Rutherford affirmed his intention that Beth Sarim should accommodate at least some of the returning "princes", and that it should stand as a monument to the organization's firm expectation, although no new date was ever assigned to the expected event.[1] The building was sold in 1948 and the doctrine of the return of the prophets dropped in 1950.[38]
What would these dates even matter ? What are they from? 1575?
If it was just a "opinion" why say it at all to your congregation…if you are the faithful servant, why are you getting... "opinions"?
Said it was a err but made a house?
If everything's going to be destroyed... Why make anything?
It seems like every heavy hard time, they predict a date to gain more followers. This last time they are seeming to use covid, and the coming war that might come, since they are talking about locking up and fear mongering through their dramas about being hunted down again.
Don’t let crises go to waste.
1933-1935
31 Eleventh, the congregation of Christ must realize a change in her work from that of gathering the “little flock” for heavenly privileges to that of gathering out the “other sheep” to become prospective Kingdom subjects to live happily forever on a paradise earth that is destined to continue unendingly in fulfillment of the great Abrahamic promise. Only the anointed remnant have experienced this since the years 1932 and 1935.—Gen. 22:18; Luke 12:32; John 10:16; Matt. 25:31-33.
What?
Serve the anointed.
Works, and if you're not doing enough you won't get to live happily ever after.
1975
What they said
‘What about the year 1975? What is it going to mean, dear friends?’ asked Brother Franz. ‘Does it mean that Armageddon is going to be finished, with Satan bound, by 1975? It could! It could! All things are possible with God. Does it mean that Babylon the Great is going to go down by 1975? It could. Does it mean that the attack of Gog of Magog is going to be made on Jehovah’s witnesses to wipe them out, then Gog himself will be put out of action? It could. But we are not saying. All things are possible with God. But we are not saying. And don’t any of you be specific in saying anything that is going to happen between now and 1975. But the big point of it all is this, dear friends: Time is short. Time is running out, no question about that.
‘When we were approaching the end of the Gentile Times in 1914, there was no sign that the Gentile Times were going to end. Conditions on earth gave us no hint of what was to come, even as late as June of that year. Then suddenly there was a murder. World War I broke out. You know the rest. Famines, earthquakes and pestilences followed, as Jesus foretold would happen.
‘But what do we have today as we approach 1975? Conditions have not been peaceful. We’ve been having world wars, famines, earthquakes, pestilences and we have these conditions still as we approach 1975. Do these things mean something? These things mean that we’re in the “time of the end.” And the end has to come sometime. Jesus said: “As these things start to occur, raise yourselves erect and lift your heads up, because your deliverance is getting near.” (Luke 21:28) So we know that as we come to 1975 our deliverance is that much nearer.’
How can you urge it, and then tell them not to?
Doesn't Mog come after the 1k reign?
35 One thing is absolutely certain, Bible chronology reinforced with fulfilled Bible prophecy shows that six thousand years of man’s existence will soon be up, yes, within this generation! (Matt. 24:34) This is, therefore, no time to be indifferent and complacent. This is not the time to be toying with the words of Jesus that “concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.” (Matt. 24:36) To the contrary, it is a time when one should be keenly aware that the end of this system of things is rapidly coming to its violent end. Make no mistake, it is sufficient that the Father himself knows both the “day and hour”!
36. What helpful example did the apostles leave us in this regard?
36 Even if one cannot see beyond 1975, is this any reason to be less active? The apostles could not see even this far; they knew nothing about 1975. All they could see was a short time ahead in which to finish the work assigned to them. (1 Pet. 4:7) Hence, there was a ring of alarm and a cry of urgency in all their writings. (Acts 20:20; 2 Tim. 4:2) And rightly so. If they had delayed or dillydallied and had been complacent with the idea the end was some thousands of years off they would never have finished running the race set before them. No, they ran hard and they ran fast, and they won! It was a life or death matter with them.—1 Cor. 9:24; 2 Tim. 4:7; Heb. 12:1
And they died… with only a few left going to the swiss alps and hidden elsewhere.
But perhaps someone will object, saying, Those words about a little while and then the wicked being no more were written about three thousand years ago, so how do we know that the end of this wicked system of things is at hand? We can be certain of this because of the fulfillment of certain Bible prophecies; for example, the prophecy by Jesus Christ concerning the end of this very system of things.
Should we not today be imitating his example, especially since we have such a short time left now in which to complete the Kingdom-preaching?
Yes, the end of this system is so very near! Is that not reason to increase our activity? In this regard we can learn something from a runner who puts on a final burst of speed near the finish of a race. Look at Jesus, who apparently stepped up his activity during his final days on earth. In fact, over 27 percent of the material in the Gospels is devoted to just the last week of Jesus’ earthly ministry!—Matt. 21:1–27:50; Mark 11:1–15:37; Luke 19:29–23:46; John 11:55–19:30.
By carefully and prayerfully examining our own circumstances, we also may find that we can spend more time and energy in preaching during this final period before the present system ends. Many of our brothers and sisters are doing just that. This is evident from the rapidly increasing number of pioneers.
Yes, since the summer of 1973 there have been new peaks in pioneers every month. Now there are 20,394 regular and special pioneers in the United States, an all-time peak. That is 5,190 more than there were in February 1973! A 34-percent increase! Does that not warm our hearts? Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world’s end.—1 John 2:17.
21 No, God, ‘with whom a thousand years is as one day,’ is not slow in allowing these few intervening years to be used for the profitable purpose of gospel-preaching. With him it is as but a few moments; and the remaining days can go by rapidly for you too. You can ‘hasten the coming of the Day of God’ by having a share in the purpose for which these days have been set aside. “This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then [and not before] shall the end come.” If the remaining days are occupied in profitable service they will not drag for you; they will fly by as though on wings.
OUR generation will see the end of the present pressure-ridden order. In fact, there is even good reason to hope that a new order of God’s making may begin within the present decade. Why is this?
They blamed people for taking it to far, but why then did their mass publication before this time also promote it?
They say, oh, possibility like YouTube has to say allegedly, but go on and make timelines and push the theory as true but sandwich it with "possible" again.
There is another way that helps confirm the fact that we are living in the final few years of this “time of the end.” (Dan. 12:9) The Bible shows that we are nearing the end of a full 6,000 years of human history. What significance does this have?
Again, they say you can't know but push it anyway.
They also say "the end of gentile times" was 1914…so that means, whoever is saved afterwards doesn't matter.
How can they say anyone who "anoints" themselves today counts then if it's over?
They now say "will see" when 1925 was "you will never die".
Wiki
In 1966 the Watch Tower Society issued the first of what became a sequence of statements on the importance of a new date—1975—that raised the possibility of that year heralding the beginning of Christ's millennial reign and, along with it, doom for unbelievers.[39]
According to this trustworthy Bible chronology six thousand years from man's creation will end in 1975, and the seventh period of a thousand years of human history will begin in the fall of 1975. So six thousand years of man's existence on earth will soon be up, yes, within this generation. How appropriate it would be for Jehovah God to make of this coming seventh period of a thousand years a Sabbath period of rest and release, a great Jubilee sabbath for the proclaiming of liberty throughout the earth to all its inhabitants! [...] It would be according to the loving purpose of Jehovah God for the reign of Jesus Christ, the "Lord of the Sabbath", to run parallel with the seventh millennium of man's existence.[40]
Another jubilee? They tried this in 1925…
Expectations for 1975 also built on the belief that Christ had set up his kingdom in heaven in 1914 and that "this generation [those who were at least 15 years old in 1914, according to a 1968 Awake![42]] would by no means pass away" before the end came.[43] The 1967 book, Did Man Get Here By Evolution Or By Creation?, similarly stated, "We find that the time of our generation, our day, is the one that is identified in the Bible as the 'last days'. In fact, we are actually living in the final part of that time. This can be compared, not just to the last day of a week, but rather, to the last part of that day".[44]
A convention badge from a circuit assembly, c.1970
In a 1969 book the Society expanded on its belief in a link between the seventh millennium of human existence and the kingdom's establishment. It stated: "In order for the Lord Jesus Christ to be 'Lord of the sabbath day,' his thousand-year reign would have to be the seventh in a series of thousand-year periods or millenniums. Thus it would be a sabbatical reign."[45] Raymond Franz, who became a member of the group's Governing Body before defecting in 1980, claimed readers were left in no doubt about what was expected in 1975, claiming: "The presentation is in no sense indefinite or ambiguous."[46]
The prophecy galvanized the Jehovah's Witnesses movement, and proselytism increased substantially. On the eve of the predicted Millennium, in 1974, the number of publishers (Witnesses who submitted their record of preaching) rose by 13.5 percent worldwide and many Witnesses were actively preparing for the dawn of the New Order.[16]
Yet as 1975 drew closer the degree of uncertainty expressed in Watch Tower publications increased. The chances of Armageddon occurring that year were initially described as "feasible", "apparent" or "appropriate", but from the end of 1968 it became a mere "possibility". In 1966 the Society characterised the chronological calculations as "trustworthy"; by 1968 it considered them "reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible)".[47] The basis of the gradual retraction was uncertainty over the elapsed time between the dates of Adam's creation and that of Eve.
In fact, says Singelenberg, from the end of 1968 Watch Tower Society publications never again explicitly focused on 1975 in a theological context. Though articles continued to remind readers that the "end of 6000 years of human history" was imminent, they increasingly highlighted non-Society sources that forecast a gloomy future with worldwide famine, ecological collapse and oxygen deficiency. The articles, says Singelenberg, featured emotional expressions of excitement, hope and urgency, with readers told: "What a time of turmoil is ahead of us! A climax in man's history is imminent!"[39]
Less-cautious language appeared in publications distributed only to members of the group. In a 1968 issue of the monthly bulletin Kingdom Ministry, adherents were encouraged to increase their preaching activities because time was running out rapidly: "Less than a hundred months separate us from the end of 6000 years of man's history. What can you do in that time?"[48] Some Witnesses sold their possessions, postponed surgery or cashed in their insurance policies to prepare for Armageddon[16] and in May 1974 the Watch Tower Society told members: "Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world's end."[49]
Talks at congregation meetings and assemblies also disseminated the prophecy. Speakers at some conventions highlighted the phrase "Stay alive till '75" and urged the audience to maintain their meeting attendance or risk losing their lives at Armageddon.[50] The Dutch branch overseer urged the audience at a "Divine Purpose" district convention in 1974 to "pioneer" (take part in full-time preaching) as the end approached:
Many of us have suffered misery, sickness and death. You don't have to experience that any more. The new order is near [...] Sell your house, sell everything you own and say, oh boy, how long can I carry on with my private means. That long? Get rid of things! Pioneer! Plan to shower people with magazines during these last few months of this dying system of things!"[51]
Yet The Watchtower's public coverage of the same series of conventions expressed a far more cautious tone. In its summary of the convention talks, the magazine reiterated the teaching that Bible chronology showed 6000 years of human existence would be completed in the mid-1970s, then pointed out: "These publications have never said that the world's end would come then. Nevertheless, there has been considerable individual speculation on the matter." What was certain, the magazine said, was that the end would come within the generation of those who saw the beginning of world tribulations in 1914. "So we can be confident that the end is near; we do not have the slightest doubt that God will bring it about [...] we have to wait and see exactly when, in the meantime keeping busy in God's service."[52]
Franz says a 1968 Watchtower article implied that members should be careful about taking too literally Jesus' cautionary words about forecasting the last days. The magazine warned: "This is not the time to be toying with the words of Jesus that 'concerning that day and hour nobody knows [...] only the Father'. To the contrary: it is a time when one should be keenly aware that the end of this system of things is rapidly coming to its violent end."[53]
In a 1970 paper, Joseph F. Zygmunt commented on the likely outcome for Jehovah's Witnesses if this prediction, too, failed: "While return to this old strategy would seem to expose the sect once again to prophetic failure, the risks are balanced by the potent ideological reinforcement accruing from this forthright renewal of faith, which thirty-five years of diffuse watchful waiting seem to have made necessary." But he added: "The risks of another prophetic failure actually appear to be minimal. The new prophecy is being phrased in a manner that lends itself to 'confirmation' by the old device of claiming partial supernatural fulfillment."[5] Beckford, too, expected no significant organizational disturbance resulting from the absence of observable effects that year, suggesting in 1975 that Witnesses were being "skilfully prepared for prophetic disconfirmation" to reduce the dangers of disappointment. He noted an increasing frequency of Watch Tower Society warnings about the futility of making precise predictions about events expected for the jubilee year.[54]
So no one younger than 15?
They speak like youtubers for their own safety of not being sued.
Were the ones pushing this punished and disfellowshipped?
Again, they didn't get it wrong it was to test their faith...and those that left (who used discernment) were going to die in the great trib.
The passing of 1975 without obvious incident left the Watch Tower Society open to new claims of prophetic failure. Instead of maintaining the prophetic significance of that year, however, the group's leaders embarked on a lengthy period of denial and purge, blaming rank-and-file membership for misreading the organization's interpretations.[16] The Watchtower initially explained that the reason for the failure of Armageddon's arrival was due to the time lapse between the creation of Adam and Eve. Although the Society had earlier argued that the gap was "weeks or months, not years", it now decided the time lapse could, after all, be years.[55]
In 1976 the magazine repeated its explanation, but declared Witnesses themselves to blame for their eager expectations about 1975 because they had misread the Bible.[39] "It was not the word of God that failed or deceived [the individual Jehovah's Witness] and brought disappointment, but [...] his own understanding was based on wrong premises."[56] In talks at conventions four years later, leading members of the Society finally acknowledged their error in the initial formulation of the prophecy, and in the March 15, 1980 Watchtower the Society said its claims about 1975 were regretted.[39] It assigned no different interpretation to the date and demanded that its members recognize that there never was an explicit prophecy.[16]
Singelenberg's analysis of Jehovah's Witness preaching activity in the Netherlands in the wake of the 1975 prophetic failure showed a drop in the group's membership from mid-1976, a trend that did not reverse until 1980. An estimated 5,000 Witnesses in the Netherlands either left the movement, were expelled, or became marginal and inactive members.[39] Singelenberg suggested many of those expelled and shunned in the late 1970s had rebelled against the group's authority structure out of "post-prophecy frustration". Post-1975 defectors were described to him and to American researcher A. J. Brose as "opportunists" who had joined the group out of fear when the end seemed imminent, yet who lacked genuine commitment.[39]
One elder told Singelenberg: "It was good that Armageddon did not take place. It separated the wheat from the chaff."[39] Researcher Mathew N. Schmalz suggested the leadership drew attention from the disconfirmation by requiring an even greater loyalty from members, a demand enforced with the expulsion of almost 30,000 Witnesses in 1978 alone. The insistence on doctrinal orthodoxy reached the highest levels of the organization in 1980, with many in the writing committee disfellowshipped.[16]
They shift blamed, then took some accountability, then shift blamed again and said those that left or disfellowshipped weren't committed anyhow… rather than that they used discernment that whoever was guiding them as "Gods spokesperson" was making God look stupid and left when they realized God wasn't with them.
Why "writing committee"? Probably because they were getting all the blame or said "YOU SAID so how are you wrong?". They give them piles to research, so what they researched was from the gov saying this is what it is and why, and then to be wrong? Meant they were misled from the very top, by those that say they are led by God. God wouldn't wrong.
Date math (pretending like I want to stamp a date as well)
Astronomy and calendars[edit]
Mosaic of Creation of Adam from Monreale Cathedral - dated year 1 A.M. (September 5509 BC) in the Byzantine calendar.
The epoch of the Byzantine calendar, used in the Byzantine Empire and many Christian Orthodox countries, is equivalent to 1 September 5509 BC on the Julian proleptic calendar (see image right).[18]
The 6th millennium BC falls entirely within the Astrological Age of Gemini (c. 6450 BC to c. 4300 BC) according to some astrologers.[19]
According to Gregory of Tours God created the world 5597 years prior to the death of Martin of Tours, which would be 5200 BC. [20]
In the book of Genesis, chapter two, God creates the first people, Adam and Eve, and sets them up in the Garden of Eden. If you do the math—based on the Torah’s internal dating system—that event happened a little less than 6,000 years ago (or more specifically, this Rosh Hashanah marks 5,784 years).
To view Shabbat Times click here to set your location
2024
According to this calendar, we aren't even near 6000. We have about 6+ generations to go if we were to go by anything (if life expectancy 70).
Other sources
20th century
What they said
JEHOVAH’S “SWORD” AGAINST “ALL THOSE OF FLESH”
9. What today is pictured by the “soil of Israel,” and whom will Jehovah’s “sword” cut off from it?
9 Shortly, within our twentieth century, the “battle in the day of Jehovah” will begin against the modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom. The ancient “soil of Israel” pictures the realm in which Christendom has operated. It pictures the standing and relationship that Christendom has claimed to occupy with God by means of his “new covenant” of which Jesus Christ is the mediator. Now is no time for anyone in Christendom to rely on any righteousness on the basis of his own merits and to boast of his own self-righteousness. Jehovah’s “sword” of warfare will cut off from this position that Christendom’s clergy claim for her all religionists who depend upon her having an acceptable standing with God.
We're in the 21st. False prophet.
We have recently heard of a colporteur who felt a little
hesitancy about selling Studies in the Scriptures in view of
their reference to the year 1914, and who, therefore, turned
his attention to the sale of Scenarios. In our opinion the
brother took a wrong view of matters. Studies in the Scrip
tures are not prophecies. The fact that our expectations re
specting the “ change” of the church in 1914 were not realized
does not signify that the prophecies failed. Our readers should
know that we never prophesied anything. We merely gave
our opinions respecting prophecies and gave the reader the
reasons for those opinions, showing the chapter and verse.
Nothing in the Bible declared that the church would be glori
fied by the fall of 1914. The author did express it as his
opinion that the church would be glorified by the time, and
gave his reasons for so thinking. Now that the date has
passed and the church is not glorified, the author is not dis
appointed. All the while he wished the Lord’s will to be done
and none other.
What the Scriptures did clearly seem to teach, and what
we did seek positively to affirm, was that, so far as the Bible
chronology would show, the times of the Gentiles would expire
with the fall of 1 9 1 4
Deflection from previous article.
Wiki
A similar statement in a 1984 Watchtower article suggested that some members of the 1914 generation "could survive until the end of the century. But there are many indications that 'the end' is much closer than that!"[61] Until its October 22, 1995 issue, Awake! similarly included the statement, "this magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away."[62]
So… how are people able to be called "anointed" today?
AS INDICATED on page 4, “this magazine builds confidence in the Creator’s promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away.”
In 1989, the notion that the missionary efforts of the Witnesses would culminate before the turn of the century was first reaffirmed, then abandoned. As first published, a Watchtower article of January 1 stated: "The apostle Paul was spearheading the Christian missionary activity. He was also laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our 20th century."[63] Nine months later a more cautiously worded statement appeared in the Watchtower: "We have ample reasons to expect that this preaching will be completed in our time. Does that mean before the turn of a new month, a new year, a new decade, a new century? No human knows".[64] In later bound volumes of the 1989 Watchtower magazines, the text of the January 1 article was amended to state that Christian missionary work "would be completed in our day" rather than "in our 20th century".
They just can't say "we've been lying to you every time" and they double speak constantly. Then blame the rank and file for getting it wrong. And gaslight them on their history over and over again.
The German library for JW may have the original still, this one is hard to prove otherwise.
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Daniel, Ancient Texts, and 1914
Unpopular fact. The Bible isn’t some single, flawless manuscript. The Masoretic Text (MT) is what most people think of as the “official” Hebrew Bible, but it wasn’t finalized until like 600–1000 CE. Way later than the Septuagint (LXX), a Greek translation from the 3rd–2nd century BCE, or the Dead Sea Scrolls (DSS), which are Hebrew fragments from 250 BCE to 70 CE. Scholars don’t just take one text and call it perfect — they compare them because the “original” isn’t in any single copy. And the DSS? Wild. They prove there wasn’t just one Hebrew Bible floating around. Some fragments match the MT, some the LXX, some are different. Take Jeremiah: the DSS and LXX have a shorter version than the MT. Or Deuteronomy 32:43 — angels are mentioned in the DSS/LXX but cut out in the MT. Psalm 22:16? MT says “Like a lion are my hands and my feet.” Awkward. LXX/DSS? “They pierced my hands and my feet.” Makes way more sense. MT is just one tradition, sometimes messy, sometimes edited. Now, Daniel. People treat it like it’s 6th century BCE prophecy, but everything about it screams 2nd century BCE. The language, the Aramaic, the history — it’s all Maccabean. Daniel 7–11 lines up perfectly with Antiochus IV Epiphanes — the guy invading Egypt, outlawing Jewish worship, desecrating the temple. After 164 BCE, the “prophecies” fall apart because the author didn’t know the end yet. Not fake, just written later than it claims. Here’s where it gets juicy for the 1914 math. Jehovah’s Witnesses take Daniel 4, do their 2,520-year countdown, and start from 607 BCE — supposedly when Jerusalem got destroyed. Here’s the problem: 607 BCE is completely wrong. Archaeology, Babylonian records, every historian? They all say 587/586 BCE. And the JWs? They cherry-pick quotes, even sneak in their own “interpretations,” to make it look like archaeology backs them up. So their 2,520-year countdown? Already off by 20 years. And if Daniel was written in the 2nd century BCE talking about Antiochus IV, it was never meant to point to 1914 anyway. So let’s put this together: DSS and LXX show MT isn’t perfect. Daniel isn’t predicting 20th century events — it’s talking about people literally getting crushed under Antiochus’ reign. And the JW 1914 math? Built on a fake starting date and a whole lot of selective reading. Daniel’s real point: give hope to Jews suffering then, not hand someone in the 1900s a prophetic calculator. Bottom line: if you strip away all the hype, Daniel is a historical text for a historical crisis, not a crystal ball for modern dates. And the MT? Not always reliable. Period.
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